Support Thread for Understanding Shh Pat

[A pair of Charlies]

Sounds like you're doing really well!!! It's hard, but sometimes it helps to step back and take the 'theory' and then think about what you know about your LO... if that makes sense? Some babies don't like to be patted, some prefer a swoosshhhhhh to a shhhhh.... some just like a little gentle pressure....anothers a pat on the bottom...and some prefer to be left alone!!

So you're absolutely right in stepping back and re-evaluating. Easier said than done. Really does sound like you're doing fantastically well!

My DS would only sleep on me (upright unless fed to sleep  ) for the first 6 - 7 weeks. I found BW and shh patt and thankfully, it did the trick of getting him into his crib. 

Do your happy dance 

Charlotte

[Sydney]

Thanks everyone!  I did my happy dance yesterday even though it only worked for one nap but that is better than nothing   What I did realize was that with the nap it worked with, I fed her and then pretty much swaddled her and laid her down as she was OT from not taking a nap - therefore very little if any A time.  This is the only way I seem to be able to get her calm before laying her down in her crib.  If any A time (and I only have her up for 30 minutes if she gets A time, including being fed), I swaddle her and then try to calm her in my arms and she just gets SO crazy. I then thought that maybe she didn't like to be held by me so I just put her down right away after swaddling her and she then fights the side lying position so I can pat/shh her, crazy eyed and figity as can be. I then try to lay her down on her back and rub her tummy instead - same thing.  I know it seems like she is OT, but I don't know how she can be with only 30 min A time which is just enough for me to get her fed and change her.  I have also tried no shh/pat, just holding of jolting and she is just so wide-eyed and concentrating on everything around her.

I feel like I have tried so many different combinations and tried taking a step back and re-evaluting (which is hard Charlotte, as you get caught up ) but not sure where to go from here. I feel like if I can get her calm before I lay her down, I have a decent chance to get her to sleep in bed, but can't figure out how to get her calm.

[Sydney]

Okay, ladies I need your honest opinions on these pics re: side sleeping.  I told you earlier that she fought side sleeping and I honestly couldn't figure out how a lo sleeps truly on their side while swaddled as it seems they would just be laying on their right or left arm and that wouldn't be comfortable.  I got one of those sleep positioners as well to help out.

So, the last two naps, dd has slept with the WHOLE 2 HOURS while in this position.  This is how she ended up after her first nap and fighting me on the side position I had her in, which you can see is more towards her stomach .  As you can see she is slightly elevated on one of the positioners but mostly on her tummy.  Would you consider this side sleeping or tummy sleeping?  Hate to think of the SIDS concerns but can't help it.  But gosh, she is just in dreamland and you can tell she is sleeping SO sound and I hate to interrupt that. 

For her 2nd nap, I put her in this position, shh/patt for 10 minutes and applied pressure through a couple of jolts and she was OUT.  I did this to see if her first nap was just a one off or if she truly liked this position and was comfortable in it.

Thoughts?  Any recommendations on how I can position her differently so she is truly "side sleeping" (which I am still a bit confused by ).  Or should I leave her be?

TIA ladies - I really appreciate all your advice/support. 

[~Alexa~]

Oh my God!! She is soo cute and she looks so peaceful!!
Well, hun, it looks more like tummy sleeping, but if she is comfy, then I would keep putting her down like this!  BUT, you need to ask your doc! I don't want to give you any advice that goes against what he thinks about SIDS!
I have an angel care monitor, so I didn't worry too much about tummy sleeping! Lots of moms let their los sleep on their tummy b/c that's what works for them! IMHO, there is no point in forcing a baby to sleep on his side just to do shpat! If shpat/or applying pressure works better while she is sleeping on her tummy, then go for it! But, always ask your ped about it!

[Catzsz]

You know I for got my first two slept better on their tummys, I may be following when I get ds out of his moses basket..which I really ought to stop folding him into.
She looks soooo cuute

[Don]

Hi Ladies,

I am new to this site. It has been very valuable reading the post about the shpat method. I started last thursday and I have been successful copule of times, but of course not always. My LO is almost seven weeks and I like him to learn ti sleep on his own.

I just need some advice. For example when I calmed him down in his crib and he is just listening to shpat but still looking with very open eyes, does that means that is he is not tired? Beacuse when I put him down he showed me the signs and he gets those very opened eyes for couple of minutes and crying starts again. Another thing there were some situations that I got him in the REM phase of sleep and kept patting and hand on the chest but he still woke and there were the wide eyes again.

Do I need more A time for him or he could be over tired? If any of you has some ideas, please let me know, because I am desperate. THis little guy needs more sleep. And is it really will take less time to make him sleep??? I just dont see the end right.

Anyway I would highly appreciate any advices. Thank you.

[A pair of Charlies]

Hi there

Sorry, got lots of questions here. Just to help get a clear picture of what is happening and how we might be able to help...

When you're putting him down for his nap, is he calm and relaxed before you lay him down? Do you shh patt before you lay him down or start it when he is in the crib? Are you timing naps by typical A times or following his cues? How is the winddown working - good, baby relaxed and calm? Have you tried shh patting just to calm, then leaving your hand there on chest or back or bottom, with a little pressure to see if he falls asleep?

And congratulations on your LO...7 weeks...ahhhh!!

Charlotte

[Padicindy]

Sdyney: Your LO is LOVELY! My LO sleeps in exactly the same way although I try to let her tummy lie on a portion of her wedge so she is slanted, and not completely on her tummy. Problem is my LO still wakes up trying to turn her head towards the mattress at the 45th minute. This I haven't sorted out why!!

[bhg13]

I have a 10 week old tummy sleeper and am just starting BW. My problem is with crying. When she wakes early from a nap, how long do I let her cry before I SHP? And for how long while I'm SHPing? As long as it takes? I may be in there all night! Please help!

[~Alexa~]

I never let my lo cry by himself.  If he started crying when he woke up form a nap, I counted to 10 seconds, if he kept crying that meant he wasn't going to go back to sleep by himself, so I went into his room and shpatted him back to sleep.  Sometimes, he went back to sleep in 5 min, sometimes he didn't go back to sleep.  I gave it 20 min of shpat and if it didn't work, then I went out of the room, took a deep breath and came back for Patrick; took him out of the room and he had some A time.
Hope this helps

[bhg13]

Okay. I'm just having so much trouble getting her through naps. It's not getting her to sleep-its keeping her there! She just slept for 30 minutes, I went in and SP for 15 and she cried the whole time. Picked her up, started over, put her down, eyes closed but not sleeping, she woke right up and we did the same thing again. Then I just resorted to letting her sleep on me while I rocked her til her next feeding.

PLEASE SOMEONE HELP ME!!

[A pair of Charlies]

Hi

How long did it take for her to go to sleep in your arms? Will she go to sleep being shh patted in your arms instead of rocked? Have your tried getting her almost asleep in your arms (SP) and then laying her down - is that what you're already doing? Sorry if it's lots of questions... just trying to understand what's happening to see if some tweaks here and there might help.

Hugs

Charlotte

[bhg13]

It didn't take long for her to fall asleep in my arms, and I SP the whole time. When I put her down, her eyes are closed but she's not fully asleep. Then I stay and still SP for at least 10 minutes when she is asleep. Then 30-45 minutes later, she's up again. I just started BW on Sunday and had a good first day because she napped well that first day. Since then-freaking nightmare! She doesn't get swaddled because she's a tummy sleeper and doesn't take a paci but it seems that she's starting to try to suck her thumb but can't really get the hang of it.

[Don]

Hi Charlotte,

thank you for your response. Well I am trying with the wind down, but I know I am not good at it. I try to sit with him in the room for 5 minutes before I put him down in his crib, but he kind of struggles in my arms, so when I put him down he still fussy or crying. But I can calm him in the crib and make him go to sleep in REM phase he wakes up though, and I dont know why. Probably I am doing something wrong and he can not switch off. I usually stop sh-ing once he closed his eyes and just carry on patting him gently when he is in the REM phase.

I am following his cues and starting with the wind down routine after 1  hour 20 minutes A time. May be it is to long for him......
I dont know, I just really want to help him get better sleeps. I had some success already so the techniqe is great, but does not always work.

Anyway if you have any ideas, I would higly appreaciate it.
Thanks,
Don

[Ophelie]

I have read the shpat how to post and I'm wondering if my way of doing it is ok.

Here is how I do it:

I take my son in the room, tell him he is going for his nap, turn on the fan, swaddle him, rock him gently with my finger in his mouth for 3 to 5 minutes (he does not take the  pacifier and seems to need to suck). After this routine, I tell him I'm putting him down in his bed for his nap - he is still awake-, put him down on his side and start shpat, put my finger in his mouth for 5 to 8 minutes (until he stops sucking  -- he always tries to eat his blanket or moves him mouth and tongue around), shpat for 10 to 15 minutes and done. He usually falls asleep after 4-5 minutes after being in his bed but I shpat longer to make sure he will not wake up.

What I'm most worried about is him sucking my pinky. As he cannot sooth himself yet since he is only 8 weeks old, I thought this was just like giving a baby a paci. but I'm not so sure anymore. Will he or is he already dependant of my pinky? I have tried to shpat without my pinky in his mouth, but he keeps looking for something to suck onto and I don't want to disrupt his sleep. Since I have started shpat, he takes great naps; 95% of the time they last between 1:15 to 2:15.

I'm so worried to AP...