Will W2S work for my 10month old?

[mom2elise]

Well, just to let you know, I've chickened out of starting tonight.   I didn't think it was fair to DD to start, as she had only one, short nap today.   

Those are just my mommy instincts kicking in, I guess.   What's another night of pinky and nursing?

What are you thoughts on moving her to one nap?   The thought occurred to me, as she's only had one nap the past two days, and even though I tried (pinky/nursing) for nap 2 she just didn't even seem tired.    I was hoping that by having the nap a bit later (like it was yesterday 1120-1250) instead of earlier (10-1050 today) she might have a longer nap, and then early bedtime?   She did start her day at 730 on Sunday, instead of 630, like she did today, though.    I dunno.   I'm grasping at straws here.   My other thought was that if she was just doing one nap, PUPD might seem less daunting to me, if I "only" had to do it for one nap and bedtime, instead of trying for two naps, and then not even getting a second nap!

Feeling like a failure for not even trying, but so thankful the DH is being supportive.

[Aishi]

Hi

I've been following your post just out of interest (our issues are completely different). Lol fwiw I think you should follow your mummy's instinct if thats genuinely what it is. If you're just procrastinating, then bite the bullet and wean the pinky- what do you have to lose? She's not sleeping well as it is so the longer you leave it I think the harder it'll be for both of you to wean later. If you do it at least you'll know you've done whatever you could. I imagine it's like weaning the dummy you just have to be persistent and consistent.

Sorry if that's a bit harsh but hopefully it'll give you encouragement to just try for a few weeks

[*Ali*]

I think you could move to one nap but if she is doing 1.5hrs or less then she'll probably still be OT at BT and find it hard to settle. You may also find if you push the morning A time too far she will short nap due to OT and then she will be even less likely to take a second nap if she has woken even later than usual.

You will probably find that once she learns to self-soothe she may well take 2 naps again. Right now she has to be very tired before she can fall asleep nursing by accident rather than just going to bed and putting herself asleep deliberately.

No worries for choosing to start tomorrow but do be aware that she *will* get OT at the beginning from resisting the new way of going to sleep and the only way to get past that will be to remain consistent with the new method.

Good luck

[mom2elise]

Well, I'm counting tonight as a success, even if I didn't really "get with the program"

Last night, DD finally fell asleep at 640, and was restless (I pinky-ed her at 800 and 900) and nursed her 140-200, and at 500-510.
She woke for the day at 710.   I had planned on trying to switch to one nap, and not start PUPD until she was established (which I know could take weeks).   But you were right in that when I put her down to nap at 11:10, she woke again at 1140, and I couldn't extend.     
She looked tired during lunch so, I took her back up at 120 to try for another nap, and put her in the crib.   She basically rolled around, pulled up to stand and played in her crib with the room lights off and sound machine on... quietly and calmly until 200.    I didn't try to pinky or nurse her.   At 200, she didn't look close to falling asleep, so I took her downstairs.   She played, had a snack at 300, and we tried for another nap at 330.   She eventually fell asleep with pinky 350-440.   

Had dinner at 600, and bath at 700.   Was in the crib at 730 and I let her roll around for a while, until she got a little fussy, and I was prepared to pinky her again.   She took it for about 5 minutes, and then rolled away.   Hugged her bear for a while, did a bit of whining and buried her head in the mattress.   And fell asleep.   Without actually having my pinky in her mouth for the last 5 minutes or so before drifting off at 800   And without crying at all.   I'm saying prayers of thanks for small successes.    I know this "doesn't count" as she did take my pinky, but this gives me a lot of encouragement to keep trying.   

I'll do my best to not rush in tonight if she wakes, and see if she can get herself back to sleep.

And tomorrow, I'll try for two naps again.   Just not sure how much morning A time to give her, as we had been doing 3.5-4.

So glad that DH is being so patient with me and my indecisiveness and stressing over DD's sleep.    And really glad that I listened to my mommy instincts as I found a new tooth popped through overnight last night.

[*Ali*]

It's great that she fell asleep without the pinky in her mouth. that is the first step in the gentle removal plan to have the LO fall asleep without the prop even though they have had it for a bit to help calm them. If you can get the pinky out before she drops off that is definitely a step in the right direction.
Yay for the new tooth! :b

[mom2elise]

Hooray!   She slept very well until I heard her stir at 400, so I gave her a 8 minute dream feed as she is used to eating overnight.    She slepy until 650, and woke up happy.   She was standing, playing with her bear when I got her this morning.   

Will try for nap1 starting between 1030 and 110.   

Feeling very encouraged!

[*Ali*]

What a great night

[mom2elise]

Yes, and hoping tonight goes well.

Not sure what to do though, about naps.   Today, she woke at 650, so I took her up to crib at 1030, but she just played and babbled etc until 1117, and woke from nap 1 at 1200.    I took her up to her crib at 330 for nap 2, but she didn't fall asleep until 420.   Not sure when she'll wake, but if she's not up by 500, she might not be tired for bedtime.   Do you think that nap 1 was OT and therefore short, or is she getting ready for one nap and we're in that awkward phase?   She didn't really seem tired when I brought her up to her crib for either nap, but she really just practiced standing, clapping, babbling, hugging, rolling etc for 40-50 minutes, with a bit of pinky-ing in there in hoes that she would drift off.    In fact, I drifted off a few times in there....it's dark, the "ocean waves" on the sound machine lulled me to sleep.     Maybe, I'm just more tired than she is?!?

Any suggestions re:tweaking the A times etc would be appreciated.   

[*Ali*]

It's hard to say if she was OT. The A time wasn't that long so I would be surprised if she was OT. More likely UT I would have thought unless you thinks he was already still tired when she woke for the day. Was she happy when she woke? Did you try to resettle her when she woke at 12?

If she doesn't seem tired at the time you are thinking to put her down for a nap then I would let her play another 15mins and reassess. You may need to go on sleep cues for a bit to work out what she likes.

[mom2elise]

Well, it's been a while since I've posted, and just wanted to give an update, and share our experiences so far.

DD is 11.5 months old now, and started walking independently in the last week!    Which means that when she stands in the crib, she can walk around very easily now.

I've found that unless she falls asleep nursing, it takes 40 minutes of rolling around and fussing and pinky-ing before falling asleep for either nap 1 or 2, or bedtime.   I do stay in the room with her the whole time, but am thinking I will try to leave, as she doesn't really want my pinky until the "very end" when she sucks for 3-5 minutes right before drifting off.   

Yesterday's EASY:

woke 600 (I consider this EW, as she didn't fall asleep until 840 the night before, and had NW at 100 and 330)
nap 1 945-1115
nap 2 (tried at 3:00... gave up at 3:30, tried again at 4:00) napped 400-500
BT (bath at 730, in crib by 800, asleep at 840... pinky at the very end)

not a peep from her all night until 320, nursed both sides 320-340.   
Woke for the day, happy at 650am

had her in the crib for nap 1 by 1020, but didn't fall asleep until 1050.

So it's sort-of working.   Suggestions?   Tweaks?   When she's just fussing, she doesn't want the pinky, and actually gets more upset if I try to put it in her mouth.   It's not untill she's actually crying hard right before drifiting off, that she will suck for a bit then fall asleep.   

Still need to figure out how to stop the overnight  nursing too.   

[*Ali*]

I think she may be getting a tad too much day sleep. I would cap that second nap at 30mins so she is ready for sleep 3hrs after that nap. My ds2 would want a 4hr A time after a 1hr nap so she probably just wasn't tired.

The onlyther suggestion I have is what I have said before and that is to wean the pinky when you are ready to do that

[mom2elise]

Thanks!   

So today, woke at 650, nap 1 (had her in crib at 1020, but actually slept 10:50-12:15) and nap 2 (4:00-4:30) (nursed her at 345, fell asleep on the nursing pillow by 4:00 so put her in the crib).

Started bath at 715, bedtime routine, nursed and in the crib by 740.   Rolled around, stood up, pinky-ed etc. and finally fell asleep at 830.   She just doesn't really seem tired at when I take her up to bath/bedtime routine, even though nap 2 was 30min.   

When she's just standing up and walking around the crib but not crying or anything, should I be laying her back down and telling her it's time to sleep, or just let her do her thing?    I almost feel like she'd fall asleep faster if she cried hard to burn off some energy!     Maybe that's a good reason to take away the pinky!
 

[*Ali*]

The standing and walking around the cot could be developmental and she is just practising her new skill. If she is doing that and not crying then I would just leave her to it and only go back to her if she cries for you.

[mom2elise]

Ok, will try to leave her to do her thing if she's not crying for me.   

She had a rough night of teething last night.    Thank goodness for Advil.     It takes 20 minutes to work, but sure does help.    Woke at 720 this morning, but has been pretty upset with the teething.

[katie80]

Just catching up after being away last week. Ali's been giving you great advice, of course.

I wonder if you're not trying to out her down a bit too late for bedtime and she's already past her sleep window.  I would try to have her down 10-15 prior to the 3hr A after a short nap, so hopefully she's asleep by 3hr.  3hr after 30min seems to be max for my DS, he actually does better at about 2.5. But, I do think the walking milestone and her inability to self-soothe are the biggest factors in why it's taking so long to settle.