Sleep and EASY support for twins and multiples

[kayra]

Yeah I  think you're right , altho it looks ot it's actually ut,  today I gave an extra 10min and they had a good nap!
Hope things get better with the boys soon Laura! Xxx

[lnh430]

Kayra, thanks for the suggestion! I started trying with the swing but the second one usually falls asleep while I'm winding down the first one. I've just been trading off who goes down first so they at least get some mommy wind down time during the day. There naps have been much better since I started though. Thanks again!

[kayra]

So glad to hear that it's working! Bless you being by yourself with a 3 yr old and such little twins, I hope you get those longer night stretches soon!

[Bel]

Hi Twin Mamas,

I was advised by the main board to drop in here for a spot of advice.

I have been happily following Tracy's mantra since my first baby was born five years ago. I since had a second child and now almost six months ago, twins (25/09/14 at 36+3).

Recently I slipped into the '2am/5am feeding back to sleep' trap with the babies. It started with their 4 months growth spurt. With my other two I would have gently extended the times between feeds or just make them go to sleep again with shush patting. As you know with twins, it is all a bit more tricky when there is a problem. When one cries the other is often woken up and I don't know how to console two crying babies at the same time other than giving them a feed.

I can't ask DH for help as he is looking after the night wakes of the my elder two (nightmares for the five year old, overtiredness for three year old occasional napper...) and his job is quite demanding.

Does anybody know of a good trick how I can get the twins back to sleep on my own? Without feeding or rocking them.
They are 5 months and 15 days old, 6.5kg and on a four hour EASY routine (although Y should be replaced by 'time with the older kids and getting stuff done'). Tweaked and diverted here and there due to the nature of a large family and its activities (moderate ones, I'm not into lots of extra curricular stuff).

I have recently extended A times so our ordinary days look like this:
7am breast feed (often they have been awake a bit earlier)
9am back asleep (wind down starts from 8.30 depending on how tired they are and they settle by themselves between 8.45 and 9am)
11am breast feed (wake up is pretty close to this mark)
12.30 onwards wind down/settling, back to sleep by 1pm
3pm breast feed (again wake up pretty close to 3pm)
I find the next nap is sometimes tricky to catch, today it all went smoothly and they were down at 5pm. But often they are overtired when they go to bed at 7pm. I hope that extending their A time is the reason it now seems better.
Usually dream feed between 10 and 11.15pm (I feed them individually so sometimes I go over 11pm).

The nights!
In the night I have started to feed on demand (not in tandem) as I wanted to see if one was going to sleep through. But I ended up feeding every hour to two hours alternating babies.
I seem to have lost the 12.30am wake up
2-2.30 one wakes and then the other is woken and I breast feed them
I also seem to have lost the 3-4am wake when they might lie there chortling for up to an hour
5am I am now shushing when they wake and there was no wake last night (first 5hr sleep in ages for me!)

I have also moved them into separate cots (next to each other) and this is cutting out waking by whacking.

I don't think they need solids yet, they are just starting to put things in their mouths, but in a couple of weeks I will start. They take a proper feed each time they wake at night and they don't seem to be terribly hungry at 7am. It seems that they can't put themselves back to sleep at night without being fed.

Any suggestions how I can get them to sleep through by myself?

We are off camping for the weekend tomorrow and I will probably jump to feeding them at the slightest peep out of fear of waking everyone... but hopefully they will stick to their one wake, fingers crossed!

Thanks for any thoughts...
Bel

[kayra]

Welcome! Sounds like you're doing an amazing job!!

One thing that occurs to me is that they seem to be getting quite a bit of daytime sleep, 2x2hr naps plus a 3rd nap is that right? Too much day sleep could be reason why they're waking in the night. At this point they shouldn't need 2 night feeds I think... If they self settle for naps it shows that they have the skills to put themselves to sleep w/o being fed even if they don't want to always use those skills
If I have to deal with 2 babies in the night at the same time I opt for shh/patting the louder one or the one I think will go off the quickest. Sometimes I'll aternate between cribs, if it's crazy I'll get dh, there's on,t so much you can do by yourself! Will one or the other take a pacifier? When they were smaller I'd hold one while shying the other but not sure you could do that at this age,
Hope sthg in there helps! You're a brave woman going camping amidst all this!!!

[babybarr]

You're definitely brave for going camping. I'm on here now cos I want you girls who understand to tell me I'm doing the right thing by not going away for the wkend!

Basically we've been invited to go with my family for a Fri to Sun stay on a term time wkend at a place around an hr away. It's next month. We'd be sharing a villa with my brother who has slightly older children. My boys are still awful at night and get up early. They can't sit still at all and the villa is open plan. I just know although my family would help we would find it stressful esp trying to keep them contained or quiet. Plus we have ds1. Also the packing. I'd still be at work on Fri and Mon. I know my family won't really underprivileged cos they'll say they'll help but really? At 5am or 2am with two screaming babies.

Tell me you understand and that you think I'm doing the right thing!

[Bel]

Hey Laura,

I just got back from the camping trip. We ended up going only for one night because my older daughter (3) got sick on Friday.

Staying in a tent is probably not too far off from staying in an open plan villa. My plan was from the start to BF as soon as there was a murmur, which I did. Two night feeds for the twinnies, older daughter waking and shouting for me once but settled with dad. Compared to what could have happened I'd call that an ok night.

The two days were completely all over the show with sleeps here and there and I didn't know how long they were awake each time.
But we got through it, had a great time with the people around us, and feel like we've had an adventure that'll get us through the dull week ahead.

I spoke to another twin mum at camp who said her girls only started to sleep through when she stopped feeding them at night (9mths). She is a single parent of three. She said it only took two nights, first night four hours of being up and the next just one. Then they slept through. I've done it with my two older kids but I am still worried doing it on my own with two at the same time.

Kayra, I've been thinking about your comment on too much sleep with 2x2hrs + nap. I seem to remember Tracy's recommendation having that cat nap at the end, but I am not sure as it's been so long since I read her book. I also can't be sure they actually sleep for that long as they don't cry when they wake. Sometimes I go in and realise that at least one of them must have been awake for some time. What would you say is an appropriate amount of sleep for nearly six months old twins (born 36+3)? I find it so hard to balance overtiredness and too much sleep...

I feel that I am going to have to do cold turkey re feeding at night. Does anybody have any recommendations on how to keep it as stress free as possible?

Thanks, lovely ladies! Good to hear that I am not alone...
Bel

[babybarr]

We stopped feeding ours by watering down the feeds as they're bottle fed. However as you can see it hasn't stopped them waking!

I think with bf you can time it and shorten the length of time. However your two are still quite little they may still need a nf for a bit?

I also agree with too much day sleep though. Try 2x 1.5hrs and a catnap or shorten the catnap to 15mins or something. Or if you think they could do it try without the catnap and do earlier bed?

[kayra]

Can't paste a link right now but I think in the Easy or Activity board it has a sticky about typical day/night sleep, a times, routines for age etc.

Laura, I hear you but I would go even just for the sake of having people around me who will be helping during the day. Yes the night might be tough but it is anyway and at least during the day there will be more hands. Your family knows what your kids are like, how old they are etc so if they're encouraging you and saying they'll help d just take them up on it! I bet O would enjoy hanging out with his cousins, no?
But I do understand your qualms, I do, I just wouldn't want you to miss an opportunity that could be fun for you, however if you feel that you really won't be able to relax and it is going to be stressful for you then don't. Xxx

[babybarr]

It's the sharing aspect and disturbing people that will be stressful for me. Anyway long story short my mum has bkd us our own 2 bed place and the others are going to share two smaller places. It actually bizarrely works out cheaper. So I'll feel more relaxed about the boys being up and we'll still get to go and get some help in the day.

[kayra]

Great solution! So glad you get less stress and help at the same time

[babyrose]

Hi do u mind if I join u's?

Boys are doing great but I want to get into some sort of proper routine with them but they are just so sleepy! They are now 21 was old and ff every 4hrs taking 5-7oz at a time. We haven't got a getting up time yet but it's between 6&7 1.5 hrs after they have been fed they want to sleep until their next feed Which I'm not sure how they can do a length of 2hrs for their age ( correct me if I'm wrong) with the way they are.

At night we Have wind down routine but it's got to be quick cos they just want to go to sleep, bath feed and bed. ( they are independent sleepers) but have a dummy. Most nights they sleep til 1am they are fed and then start stirring at 4ish, which before I just fed them but this morning I just kept rep lugging their dummies and hoped for the best! I gave up about 6. Maybe if anyone has any advice as I'm not sure with them being premature that's making them so sleep.

Thanks

[kayra]

Welcome Nicola!
Could it be their bout of illness, so they have lots of catching up to do? How much total sleep do you think they're getting? On a good day dd is happy with about 15hr sleep and she's 10mths!
At this age 4hr easy was I'm possible for me because they couldn't do a long A time, probably the same as yours, but no way napped all the way to the next feed, often I rarely managed to get them to 3 hr since the previous feed sometimes! So sounds pretty good to me and it doesn't look like its spoiling their night really...?

[Bel]

Hi ladies, just needing someone to talk to... it's sometimes so tough looking after four kids, two of them being baby twins. It's night time here in New Zealand and I'm dreading the four wake ups I'm probably going to face. Humph.

[babyrose]

Hi, I'm maybe just thinking it's their age being premature?they were 10 wks early. I think perhaps 18-20hrs which I thought was quite a lot but considering they are 11wks really, which kind of goes with that age group.nights are pretty good ( I think!) B/time is usually 6:30/7 they will sleep til 1 and tend to feed then they take a full feed 6/7oz and then up at 5 for a feed. Does that sound OK or do u think I should d feed around 10/11pm? I can't seem to stay awake any longer than 8:30!

Hi bell how is your night going? Your doing well looking after 4!