Author Topic: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help  (Read 14085 times)

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Offline *foxy*

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #45 on: March 16, 2012, 06:21:32 am »
She woke at 10.45pm but amazingly went back to sleep on her own! But she was up at 5.20am (ugh) the EW's are horrible!

Yesterday was

Wake: 5.45
Nap 12.15-2.15 (I had to wake her)
We put her in her cot at 6.50pm as I knew it would take longer for her to go to sleep with me doing the GW. She finally fell asleep at 7.40pm.

Should I do an early nap today? Say 11.30? And then try an earlier BT? I've been sticking to a 12.15 nap for a while now but the EW's are not improving ????

I've bought a Gro clock out of desperation, she might be a bit young but at least I can refer to it to let her know that 5.20am is not an acceptable wake up time!


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Offline Bex09

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #46 on: March 16, 2012, 13:26:54 pm »
Yay fab news on the self settling! Sounds like the GW is really paying off already hey?

Ugghh for the EW though, they are just awful. Personally I would try for an earlier nap and BT and try to keep your day closer to 12 hrs. Hard I know when they EW but if you can get your DD sleeping for longer nights then you can work on pushing her wu time out slowly then.

For us a longer day, like 13 or 14 hrs always got us a shorter night, still does. If we stick to a 12 hr day we get a 12h night. I guess it is that DD gets OT with a long day and then that causes the EW. Just my experiences though.



Offline clairebear79

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #47 on: March 16, 2012, 14:25:10 pm »
I certainly agree with Becky that long day often leads to short night b/c the long day causes OT, however I would still be wary of pulling the nap earlier on a consistent basis as earlier nap & earlier bedtime will still leave you stuck with the earlier wakeup.  Yes  she may be more rested to handle pushing the day out at a later stage, but then you have to do this same process all over again.  So I would say stay with it.  I think the other thing to consider too, is that its ok shortening the day, but if the reason she is taking a long time to settle at BT is because she is UT, then this problem won't resolve itself by bringing everything earlier b/c she will still be UT at BT, IYSWIM?

Is she waking happy & ready to start the day at this EW???  Or crying & sounding tired???  If its the latter then I say try the earlier nap & BT for sure.  But if she's raring to go, then I can't help but wonder if she might need a little nap trim.  We're doing this now with my DS b/c we suddenly got 10.5hr nights/EW & I know he's not OT b/c he's been sleeping fabulously for the last 2 months for the first time ever!!!  We're still not quite there yet, but his nights have definitely lengthened since I trimmed the nap.  He's now doing 5.75-6hrs A / 1.75hr nap / 5hrs A but I have a feeling we'll need to cut the nap to 1.5hrs to get a consistently longer night.

HTH.x

Offline *foxy*

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #48 on: March 16, 2012, 17:37:56 pm »
Thankyou for your replies, I need the support right now! These EW's are driving me crazy!

I was at work so my dp did the nap today, she was knackered so he tried an earlier nap at 11.30 but she was having none of it and didn't settle until 12.10. She's usually brilliant for her nap so its very out of character for her. She slept for 2 hours.

When she wakes early she's quite happy, no tears. This morning I used the Gro clock for the first time and kept her in bed until 6am, she lies next to me quite happily for a bit then sits up and plays.

So tomorrow I should keep the nap at 12.15 (as we've been doing for about a week) and wake her after an hour and 3/4? And keep BT at 7.30? Is this in the hope that she'll eventually wake later even though she'll have a very long day and will be OT at BT?


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Offline Kay Dee

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #49 on: March 16, 2012, 17:59:38 pm »
Hiya, having much experience of nap capping with my pair I tend to agree with Claire. It sounds like some of the bedtime resistance and EW are down to the nap still being slightly too long for her and pulling everything earlier may make the EW worse. So I would stick to the 1 3/4 hr nap at 12.15 for another few days and if you manage to get a better night or later wake-up at any stage try for 1.5hrs at 12.30. I do think this will really help.

Well done on the GW! Sounds like great progress. I had to do this with my DD a few months ago and it does really work, but became much easier for us once we had the nap capping right too.

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Offline *foxy*

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #50 on: March 16, 2012, 20:03:11 pm »
Hi KDee

Thankyou for your post. I know Claire is very kindly giving me good advice. Im just so sick of the BT battle and the EW's, I'm getting very impatient. And I keep thinking how does giving her less sleep help with OT? In terms of that she must be tired, having such a long day? And things seem to be getting worse rather than better - earlier WU and taking longer to settle.

I'll keep sticking with it, she looks so exhausted so I hope things improve soon.

GW seems to be working, she gets very frustrated and sometimes bangs her head on the cot sides which I don't like but tonight she didn't keep trying to grab my hand, she just needed me to put my hand on her back which is great progress.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2012, 20:06:55 pm by *foxy* »


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Offline clairebear79

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #51 on: March 16, 2012, 21:45:17 pm »
Ooh I typed a reply to you earlier & thought I'd hit post but clearly I hadn't!  KDee seems to have said pretty much what I had typed anyway but here it is:

When you start to trim the nap you don't want the A time to BT to increase really, as a shorter nap AND a longer A time will probably cause more OT.  And of course her day is already on the long side.

So....if you are happy to go with an earlier BT short term & would prefer to try & sort the EW before pushing things on any later, you could try capping the nap where it currently is i.e. 12.15-2 & then aim for a slightly earlier BT perhaps 7-7.15pm & hope she sleeps in til after 6 - that way you aren't stretching her day any longer.  Of course if you ultimately want to get to a later wakeup & BT in the end, at some point you will have to push her nap & BT out later again.

The other way to tackle it would be to push out the nap an extra 15mins first, and then start to cap, or you could push out & cap at the same time, so it starts 15mins later at 12.30 but ends at 2.15.  Then aim for 7.15pm BT (7.30 absolute latest).  If this doesn't help then you could push it all another 15mins later & do a 7.30pm BT, or you could cut the nap back further to 1.5hrs as KDee suggests. 

I keep thinking how does giving her less sleep help with OT? In terms of that she must be tired, having such a long day?
I know it seems like cutting out a bit of day sleep is crazy if they are OT, but if the OT is from too long a day, which is caused by a short night through being undertired at BT, then cutting the day sleep will hopefully help her settle better at BT and sleep for longer at night, which will get rid of the OT.  By keeping a longer nap, she will keep resisting BT & sleep a shorter night, therefore getting less sleep overall.  

Take my LO for example.  Til a couple of weeks ago he was doing 5.5hr A / 2hr nap / 5hr A and 11.5hr night.  All of a sudden we are getting 10.5hr nights if we have a 2hr nap.  We've cut 15mins off the nap & its put his nights back to 11.25-11.5hrs.  So 15mins less day sleep = 45mins-1hr MORE night sleep.  In my mind its definitely worth it.  Of course I am basing this all on my LO & what he's doing, & they are all different & I can't see your LO & see how tired she is, so don't feel under any pressure to do what I suggest!  Have you noticed all the other similar threads from mums of 18 month olds atm though?  All with EW or nap resistance/refusal or BT resistance or all 3?  Its pretty common at this age & partly related to 18 month sleep regression & partly related to a drop in sleep needs.  At the end of the day our wee ones are getting older, and as they get older they need to sleep less.  Sad but true!

Offline *foxy*

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #52 on: March 17, 2012, 06:33:53 am »
Thankyou Claire, that makes sense now. I'm sticking to the nap trimming as I didn't really want to go back to early BT's.

And the fantastic news is she woke at 6am instead of 5.30!!! Amazing!!!!

We had one NW at about 10.30. My dp went in and she was standing up in the cot (not a good sign usually) he spoke to her softly and she lay back down and went to sleep! Without him doing anything else! Also amazing!! Then she slept through until 6am!

So today we'll try a nap at 12.30 and see how she gets on. Should we just go for it and wake her at 2.15? I'm scared of more OT creeping in! But we're doing so well that I don't want to ruin things.


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Offline Kay Dee

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #53 on: March 17, 2012, 07:39:56 am »
Brilliant! I would definitely wake her by 2.15 at the latest, especially after a better night like that. IME giving a longer nap after a good night can lead to more UT bedtime resistance or EW. And then you should be good for a 7.15/7.30 bedtime.

What time did she settle last night? Have you added up her sleep totals at all? Sorry for all the qs, just trying to get a picture of her overall sleep needs and whether you'll need to cap a little more....

Yay for the later wake-up through! I hope you slept well too x
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Offline *foxy*

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #54 on: March 17, 2012, 08:04:21 am »
Hi

She settled at 7.40pm last night. Woke at 5.30, nap 12.10-2.10. So 14 hour day with a 2 hour nap. am A time 6 hour 40mins, pm A time 5 1/2 hours. Is that what you mean?
She never goes to sleep before 7.30pm no matter what time we put her down. So I think its important to start the nap at 12.15-12.30?


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Offline clairebear79

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #55 on: March 17, 2012, 13:47:13 pm »
Yes that sounds like a good plan.  And yay for the later WU!!!!!

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #56 on: March 17, 2012, 19:44:48 pm »
Great success tonight. She fell asleep at 7.30pm without any contact with me! She needed settling a couple of times (when she hit her head on the cot sides) with me just stroking her back but she fell asleep all on her own. It's still taking about 30 mins for her to go sleep but I'm hoping that will change as she gets better at self settling.
Let's hope we have a 6am (or later!) WU again!
« Last Edit: March 17, 2012, 20:06:21 pm by *foxy* »


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Offline Bex09

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #57 on: March 17, 2012, 20:24:29 pm »
Oh well done, you have made fantastic progress. :)

I am sure that as your DD gets more and more used to settling herself to sleep that it will take less and less time for her to fall asleep. When we did GW it took about 40 mins the first night, then 30 mins for a few nights and then down to about 15. Now DD falls asleep within about 5-10 mins of us leaving her room usually.

So what is your plan now in terms of moving further away? Are you still making contact with a hand on her when she cries or not?



Offline clairebear79

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #58 on: March 17, 2012, 20:31:11 pm »
Great progress!!! FX'd hun!xx

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Re: 18mo taking 45mins-1hr to settle at BT-please help
« Reply #59 on: March 17, 2012, 21:26:28 pm »
Hi

Yes, I'm still making some contact with her because she's hit her head on cot sides out of frustration and she's hurt herself. But each night I'm making sure that we're progressing with it. I'm going to try to not make any contact at all next and once we've achieved that then I'll start moving away. Does that sound ok? She used to need SO much help and I was rocking her to sleep not so long ago so we've come along way in just 4 nights.

Her nap today was 12.20-2.10, we're at the grandparents tomorrow for her nap so I'm praying she'll nap ok there. They look after her every Friday whilst I'm at work so its a familiar place for her.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2012, 21:29:37 pm by *foxy* »


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