anyone want to chat about the 2-1 nap switch , thread#3

[NiknLily]

Hi & welcome.  I have to say I really don't envy you going through this with twins, my idea of hell    Lets hope the ladies here can make it as painfree as possible.

Some LO's will only sleep 10hrs at night no matter what you do, I don't think it changes hugely tho' from what they used to get before transition.  So if they always took 12hrs at night then the chances are they will still need at least 11.5hrs at night once transitioned.

It does seem to be the case that while transitioning most LO's go through the EW phase, for some the problem resolves itself, for others like myself I had to shift DD day as we were doing 12hr day from 5am-5pm.  Generally EW's start when they get OT.  Some manage to get over the OT and the EW dissapear but for me it took DD a long time to anyway near cope with the transition and get through the OT by which time the early start had stuck.

[LauraRose]

Hi!

I've been having the same problem as newmum did with OT and EW.  This week (starting Saturday) I forced a shift for ds because we were stuck in 5 am waking and 6 pm bedtime. We are still on 2 naps (he's only almost 13 mos)--one 1.5-2hr in am and one1 hr in pm.  For us the EW self-perpetuated.  We solved the tiredness issue with early bedtimes, but that just reinforced the EW.  Now I won't put ds to bed until 7-7:30 and he's already shifted from a 4:30 wake up (on current time) to a 5:45 wake up.

Hope we can encourage you and offer some suggestions. Good luck!

[jmoran544]

Thank you, LauraRose. I am always concerned about putting them to bed early. I know it's supposed to prevent them from being overtired, but we have rarely had the experience of them sleeping longer into the morning. The best the kiddos did was wake really early, then after an hour of crying they went back to sleep. This doesn't work for me, either. I think a later catnap might help us push bedtime later, therefore the morning. Maybe?

[marcimommy]

hi ladies,

my LO is 8 months old and his naps were getting shorter and shorter. He is perfectly happy and rested though and sleeps 11-12 hours unbroken during the night. Now and then we get an EW but very rarely. Anyway today we had a wonky day and he decided he wouldn't nap until 12:00 p.m.  I mean he was up for 5 hours straight. He was perfectly happy except when the nanny tried to put him down. Than at 12:00 p.m. he went down like an angel and napped until 2:45 p.m.  He is happy as a clam right now at 4:30 p.m. Is it possible that he is ready to switch that early? Over the weekend he had some long AM naps and a very short PM naps (just like a catnap) I am confused  Please shed some light!!!  Thanks

[NiknLily]

Goodness, hes very young, I would say too young to transition.  Most of the ladies on here currently have young LO's for the transition but I think the youngest was 10months.  This is a bit out of my depth, him being so young but I can offer some advise to get you started.  I think maybe a general post in the naps forum might get a better audience, plus the mods will be more likely to pick you up but if I can help I will try

Firstly I would say to try every way possible to not let him take any more 1 nap days.  The very first 1 nap nap is always the best, from then on if they happen to frequently you run into serious OT very quickly.  If you do get a 1 nap day get him to bed as early as possible that night.  How long where the long am naps? I would say that maybe you do need to try to even out the naps by not letting him nap too long in am.  Can you post what was a normal day and a typical day over weekend.  It may be that the short catnaps are getting him OT which may be why he wouldn't sleep until 12pm by which point he would of been zonked or of course he could really be transitioning in which case your in the right place and we will do everything we can to help it go smoothly 

[LauraRose]

Jmoran544-- You've described the same experience I've had.  It definitely works for OT, but y'know--the mornings!! Yikes. I think if you don't have a chronic EW problem, then the early bedtime is a great catch-up. But, lately my theory has been--put off the am nap and risk OT early in the day, which could result in a poor nap, but eventually (like if I stick to this for a week or more) should get me a good, solid morning nap.  Then, offer another nap in the late afternoon (3-4?) and hopefully make up some more sleep there, if needed.  Then, regular (7-7:30) bedtime, in hopes that an 11-12 hour night will eventually become the norm--and (I start getting all weepy with joy here  ) a 6-7 am wake up!

[sorayas mom]

Hello ladies, I am back with another question!
To update you, the 11-12 am nap and 4-4:30 pm nap stopped working and she wouldn't go to sleep until closer to 11:45 thus leaving no time for a pm nap.  So after a week of just one nap and an early bedtime we ran into OT, so that plus the time change and we had a mess on our hands!  She didn't get out of control OT, just borderline so we just went back to two naps and today was day 3 of two naps.  The past two days I've had to hold her for her pm catnap as she would not go to sleep on her own.  Am I better off keeping two naps daily even if I have to hold her in the sling every day for the pm catnap?  I know it's ok now and then to fight off OT, but I wasn't sure if I should continue if it turns into an everyday thing!  Right now here is what's been going on:

7- wake
10:45 - 11:45/12 - nap
4- 4:30- nap
7- bed

And even though the catnap is so late she has still been falling right to sleep at 7!

Thanks for the help!

[NiknLily]

Hi Sorayas Mom
Thats a tricky one, I guess it really depends on if you can cope with it daily.  As she can't completely cope with 1 nap, would it be worth trying 2 1 nap days then a 2 nap day to catch up.  Or any combination that keeps her from getting OT.

As you already know it wont be for long, another month down the line and her needs will be totally different, so its a judgement call on your part really if you think she needs it and you can cope then go for it.  In terms of AP its not really relevant as she will soon drop that catnap anyway

[jmoran544]

A new development. For the last two days my ds has woken up at the 45 min mark into his morning nap. Yesterday I put him down 4.45 hrs after waking, and today I stretched it even longer, to bring up wake time from 5:30am to anytime later.

Before shifting to a later am nap, ds woke at the 30 min mark, and barely slept a good pm nap.  I started putting him down later, and for about a week he has slept more than an hour for the am nap, and then a 30 min catnap in the pm (I wake him).

So what's up with the 45 min? Yesterday he fell back to sleep after talking to himself for about 20 min. Today he's crying. I'm hoping he'll go back to sleep...

[skatty]

Hi everyone, I have been AWOL as I have been very sick (throwing up  ) To make things worst L woke this morning crying and burning all over with a temp of 39+. We took her to the doc and she either has a virus or is one of the miniscule percent of LOs that can get a full on fever and ill with teething, which I think is likely as it always coincides with teeth  . She has only had one 2 nap day recently and that is the day DH took over because I couldn't look after her and he put her down at 4hrs A time so she only slept 45 mins and woke singing! She took another 30 min catnap and still wanted to go to bed at 5.30pm so I don't think two naps work here anymore. We had our first long nap yesterday 1hr50 mins  She woke after 1hr5 and went back to sleep. She's napping now so I have my fingers crossed for a long one but she is coughing her damned teethng cough 

Sorayas Mom, I would definitely carry her in the sling for a catnap if it keeps OT away, before you know it she wont be wanting the catnap anymore. L only had teh catnap a few weeks and now has a regular bedtime between 5.30 and 6pm which I am hoping to move towards 7 once her A time increases or nap extends.

J Moran, I have said it before but my hat really goes off to you having twins to cope with, especially when they seem to thrive on such different schedules. Your DS sounds so much like Leorah a few months ago and now looking back I think I just had to ride it out until she could cope physically with the A times she wanted. At around 10/11 months I was putting her down in the AM after 3 hours as is recommended but she was only taking 30 mins which I presumed meant she was OT but then I'd put her down early for her PM nap and she'd only sleep 45 mins max and she'd have a huge stretch to bedtime so went very early and then the whole cycle would start again  I actually ended this cycle by accident a few days before her birthday when she had a doc appoimtement right at nap time so had to go 4.45 before her nap and she slept 1hr10 which was brilliant for her and then had a PM catnap went to bed for 7pm and slept through until 6.30am with no NW which was amazing at that time. I kept to the long AM nap and catnap until the clocks changed and then it just got too cold and dark to be dragging her out just to let her sleep for 20 mins so I bought bedtime forward and all has stayed ok so far. This time is rough but it does end as I can now finally believe and all those NWs, EWs and chronic short naps seem like long ago even though it has only been about a month. I am desperately hoping things aren't going to fall apart...

We are going away for the weekend tomorrow with the whole of DH's noisy family, I'm dreading it! I know the odds of her napping well and having no NWs are beyond slim and just hope we get back on track well when we get home.

I hope you all have a good weekend 

[NiknLily]

Jmoran544 - Lily started to wake at 45Min's into her naps when transitioning and apart from 2 days ago when she slept for 1.5hrs before waking then went back down for another 45 after, she still does.  Its not always 45Min's sometimes its 1hr and I always have to do WI/PD/WO for her to settle back to sleep, Oh tell a lie 1 time I didn't about a week ago.

I cant remember exactly how old Lily was when we started this, about 15months I think.  Well she is now 18months and has been on 1 nap for about 2months and we are only just starting to get good naps of 2-2.25hrs, but so far these are still broken with wake ups which she needs resettling from.  NW's haven't completely stopped either we are down to about 1 a night, fortunately generally before my bedtime.

So I guess what I'm saying is expect the unexpected, nothing stays the same for 5 Min's and even when you think you have it cracked it can still be months before you really do.

Skatty, sorry to hear you & L are so poorly, hope you both feel better real soon 

[LauraRose]

Alright everyone--yesterday Jack had his first one-nap day.  He did pretty well with it.  Had a late am nap (11:15) and slept for 2:40 min! Then, he didn't want a catnap at 4 when I put him down.  He slept later today too!

Skatty--hope you are both well soon.

[NiknLily]

Thats terrific LauraRose 

On a cautionary note just watch for that nap length to get shorter if this starts go back to 2 naps for a few days for him to catch up.  As I've said before the first 1 nap days are usually the best and in my experience can rapidly go down hill from there.  I could never get my head round how they could get more sleep on a 1 nap day, get a beautiful nights sleep and still be OT the very next day

That said, fantastic nap, heres to many more 

[katemom]

just a quick question for you guys, do you know how long the average nap length is when lo's transition to one nap a day?

katemom

[LauraRose]

newmum-- My plan is to offer the first nap later (11-ish), then also to offer the catnap (at 3 if his am nap is short, 4 if it's long), then bed between 7 and 7:30.  Sound ok? I think that will give him a chance to catch up if his naps get short.

katemom--Our experience here seems to be that if lo is doing two naps but transitioning it's pretty good to get one 1:15min and one 1hr nap--hoping for more, of course. Then, I guess a 2:30min single nap day is good, always hoping for more